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PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2014 10:01 pm 
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Posts: 32
Having overcome 2 major problems with my new X10 I have now hit another. After a backup of my first 388 albums I entered another 23 today and after the long wait for the conversion proceeded to do another backup. After some time the process came to a halt showing merely the name of a track on the screen. I managed to identify the track and deleted the whole album to be safe and started again. In all, this happened a further three times and I was able to identify the source and remove the offending album on two occasions.

However, the last stop was a track showing a portion of an unidentifiable song title in German and this produced hours of wasted time and anxiety as I struggled to find the source. Purely by a process of elimination I removed the remaining German album and also ran a Recovery in the hopes that it would pick up any other irregularity in the DB. This seems to have been successful and I now have another up-to-date (apart from the albums I deleted) backup.

I can see possible problems like this again since while running a backup X10 shows the individual tracks it is processing and this is information which it has gleaned from the FreeDB or on-line or whatever and bares no real relevance to the information which the user has input or which is printed on the CD cover. For example, while processing a choral item or an opera the individual tracks will be snatches in Italian, French, German, Russian etc and these are not readily recognisable thus making the investigation and correction of the problem very difficult.

To do what I did today I did something that years of working with PC's has taught me to be an absolute no-no in that the only way I could stop the process and deal with the problem was to switch of at the mains. What is desperately needed here is an option to Skip a track should the computer hang. I would rather have a backup missing only one track somewhere rather than no backup at all.

Have I hit another unique problem or has someone else experienced this?


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 08, 2014 12:50 am 
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Joined: Tue Aug 23, 2011 11:41 am
Posts: 117
Backup should wk fine.
Have you updated the firmware?
I think the new (discontinued) fw had backup delays.
Or due to the file structure it could conflict with the old files, so best to use firmware 1692 for backup until the newer version is out ...
Does it behave the same if you try & backup on a network or PC share (net)?
Do you get a timer?
(i wouldn't go deleting tracks if i were you :) best to start properly)
Is the backup device well formatted in NTFS?


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 08, 2014 5:28 pm 
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Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2012 10:02 am
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When I have done a backup, I've always picked the option to do a Recovery scan first just in case.

I think the titles you see during the backup should be the titles you see in the MusicDB (not the album names, but the track titles, as you say).

Are you using the newest firmware (release number 1754)? It sounds like a lot of people have had trouble with it. See especially http://www.cocktailaudio.co.uk/Forum/viewtopic.php?f=23&p=6089, and scroll down to post by voiceedit.

I've stuck with the previous firmware release: the last one listed at http://www.cocktailaudio.co.uk/firmware.shtml. Backups seem to run smoothly for me with that one.

If you are getting repeated failures with individual tracks when you try to backup, rename and so on, then it does sound (sad to say) like you may be having problems with the hard disk. I know elsewhere you were considering re-formatting, and this might be a sensible choice if things don't settle down. It might also just be worth opening the hard disk enclosure and making sure the connections to the disk are good and tight.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 09, 2014 2:06 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2014 12:42 pm
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Firmware updated to 1754.
External HDD formatted NTFS and has accepted dozens of backups before the event I reported and 5 subsequently.

[(i wouldn't go deleting tracks if i were you :) best to start properly)]
If there is a track which is faulty such that the backup falls over, there would seem to be no other solution or give up doing backups forever.

Interesting point about doing a Recover before a Backup. As you remember, marriedto51, my first disaster struck when I ran a Recovery and lost my entire database - and this happened on 2 occasions. One of the difficulties I have is that I do not have a clear idea of exactly what Recovery does. The Recovery Results of my first two efforts just showed hundreds or perhaps thousands of tracks marked as Deleted but I have checked on subsequent Recoveries and there are just a handful of entries, some Deleted and some Moved but I have not been able to relate them to anything I have done and the database seems intact. However, as your advice has been comfortingly common sensible previously I shall try this as a routine in future. I must point out that I have done 5 Backups since the events described in the above post without any problems.

I don't think I can classify my problem as "repeated failures with individual tracks". I shall certainly consider the re-format if this recurs.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 10, 2014 2:50 pm 
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Curioser and curioser!
Since the above post I ipped another 22 Albums and then ran a Recover which reported that everything was OK so I ran a successful backup.
I then ripped another 17 Albums and ran Recover again and it has - for the third time - moved all 520 Albums except one to the Recovery Results and marked them as DELETED:! I will report this as a follow up to my first post since it is the same problem.


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 11, 2014 1:45 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jun 22, 2013 1:54 pm
Posts: 38
KenWA wrote:
Curioser and curioser!
Since the above post I ipped another 22 Albums and then ran a Recover which reported that everything was OK so I ran a successful backup.
I then ripped another 17 Albums and ran Recover again and it has - for the third time - moved all 520 Albums except one to the Recovery Results and marked them as DELETED:! I will report this as a follow up to my first post since it is the same problem.

Hi KenWA
When I firstly started to rip CD's I also ran into some strange behaviour similar to yours, the problems always seemed to be with Classical CD's where the Album title contained either a dollars sign $ or a colon : (although there are may forum posts from users who have many Albums with $ and : characters). A second way of breaking things seems to be if I go change any of the meta data before all of the albums tracks have been converted.
So my method for successful ripping is :-
1. Connect a keyboard and boot up the X10
2. Insert a CD, Before ripping - check modify the Album title to remove any unwanted characters such as $ and :.
3. Rip the CD
4. Follow 1. and 2. above for more CD's
5. Using a web browser, check progress of conversion. When all tracks from an album are converted, only then to check and change any of the the meta data.
6. When all is complete run a database recovery (using the above method always seems to recover with no errors for me).
7. If database recovery is successful to then back up.
:)


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 28, 2014 4:43 pm 
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Joined: Thu Mar 28, 2013 12:39 pm
Posts: 5
Hi

Just reading through this thread as I am having trouble with a backup run hanging with a track title and the timer on screen for hours. Where in the manual does it say that the external HDD (I am using a Touro 1TB USB drive with other stuff already on it) needs to be NTFS formatted please? Is this just something people have learned by their mistakes?

I want to use the backup to populate my DB onto a second X10 that I have just bought.

Steve


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 28, 2014 5:35 pm 
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Joined: Thu Mar 28, 2013 12:39 pm
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PS After some further playing around it seems that the tracks that the backup hangs on are all on albums that I have ripped since the latest FW update was applied. I have searched the track that it hangs on and deleted the whole album each time, and it just hangs on another recently ripped album track!

I hope we haven't got a solution to the Cover Art problem at the expense of not being able to run a back up! Grr!


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 9:54 am 
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Joined: Thu Mar 28, 2013 12:39 pm
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Update: I ran a Recovery on the X10, which took a long time, but after that the backup (which also took about 5 hours) also ran successfully.

I have also successfully done a Restore from the backup onto my second X10, although mysteriously, albums and artists do not appear in alphabetical order in the listings. Any ideas how to get this back?


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 8:29 pm 
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Joined: Wed Oct 05, 2011 1:32 am
Posts: 312
Come on don't you read the notes? :)

Page 4: -1.7 Selected album name (text display) and ‘Sorting’ status category
http://cocktailaudio.co.uk/firmware/R17 ... 760_UK.pdf

Even here:
viewtopic.php?f=20&t=131


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